new thread
First of all, thanks to everyone who was really supportive of me. As you remember, I'm a long haired teenager whose grades slipped below 90, and my Dad ordered me to get my long hair cut off. I read all your advice but it didn't work. The reason I haven't posted here is cause I've been too embarrassed. After my Dad ordered me to the barber shop, and I begged, pleaded and finally hid from him, everything seemed to die down for almost a day. Until Thursday night. Dad came home very angry from a bad day. It was late and the rest of us already ate and I was in my room. Dad came in without knocking- always a bad sign. He said "You skipped the barber again, huh?" I remained silent. He ordered me to sit at my desk and when I stalled, he yanked me by my arm and sat me at my desk. He reached into the top drawer and took out scissors, lifted up a hank of my hair, and hacked it off. He did it 4 times, practically down to my scalp. He tossed the handfulls of hair on the floor, and then told me to get to the barbershop in the morning to have hiom straighten this out. I was crying hysterically and when I looked in the mirror (after trying not to for a long time) I saw the top of my had was practically bald, and there were enormous bald patches on the right side. The back length was totally gone. I almost died when I had to walk into the barber shop the following day to see if he could make this better...and I took off my baseball cap, and his eyes opened wide, and he said "What the HELL did you do". Anyway, he bussed off the remaining hair, and I now have what's called a #1 buzz. I'm still shaking from this experience, and I thank you for all your help. Dennis
Poor Denis.
What an horible storry is that. I just can't believe that there are still existing such narrow minded father. This doesn't make sense as I am sure it won't help your relation AT ALL... It won't ether motivate you to have better result at school.
What a mess!...
What a demonstration of the stupidity human are capable of.
Please remember that human are not all the same (Thank God!...).
I am really deeply choked by what you told us and, as a father myself of two young adults, it hurt me to realise that there are still representant of the "Cromanion" in year 2000...
Stay strong and remember that your hairs will grow back and that you have learn a lot on the behavior of your father. You have your own life to assume and stay concentrate in that.
Hope that this forum can be a refuge for you when you need it.
Take care
Jean
I am sorry to hear this. It is difficult to live with this idiot together in the same house for the next time. You could make it public and/or report it to the police, maybe he will get his punishment for child abuse. This could help to avoid similar situations in other families. But I don't know if this is reasonable for you, maybe you will not escalate the situation.
Sometimes in the futur he will feel weak and then he will need you, and it will come the time where he needs appreciation from you.
But where do it come from?
I would concentrate myself to finish my education and then live my own way. After my opinion there is nothing wrong if you kick him off out of your life, but I think also that progress in human evolution is only possible if the next generation is a little bit better then the previous one. Go your own way and feel better with your own children. This chapter of your life has terminated. That it has found a bad end is not your fault.
wolfgang
Dennis ,
When I read this , my hart stood still for a moment , and I
almost started crying ! How in the world can a father be
so narrow minded about his son having long hair !
I almost felt the anger that you must have been feeling , inside me !
What can I say ?
I can only say , that it will grow back , your only 17 , so your
still young , so when you're 20 you'll have it all back.
Hope this helps , I really feel sorry for you Dennis.
Be strong !
Ronny.
Maybe I am alone in my thought that this may just be another one of the stories that are posted on this board that my be a little stretch of the truth. After reading this latest post over a few times...it seems fabricated. Anybody else have the same feeling. If it is true and may be...then I would be the first with an apology.
Unfortunately, my story is true. And, if you ever went through what I went through, you'd know that it's painful enough to experience it and write about it, without having people doubt you. I'll ignore the posters who call my truthfulness into question, and thank those who sent their best wishes. Thanks, Dennis.
IMO for a teenager who is still shaking from the experience, this account seems just a little too vivid, a little too articulate.
So "Curious", man without a name or an e-mail address, you wonder if this is for real? If a man believes in what he says, he oughtn't be ashamed to sign it, and you do have a point. Maybe it's a good time to take stock once in a while and look at some numbers. I just did that, and I don't see a lot of commitment here.
I just looked at the board. It has 153 total messages:
87 (57%) have no email shown at all17 (11%) have hotmail or similar pseudo-addresses26 (17%) have real addresses but you can't tell their names from them23 (15%) gave real email addresses that indicate their first and last names and a real web connection, or information from which you can actually ascertain who they are including both their first and last names
The 23 posts from readily identifiable people came from just seven men:
Victor Engel (the webmaster)Bill Choisser (myself)Scott LeigeberRodney McCoySteven WinnerWolfgang SalzmannCharlie Malarkey
I will add that there were 6 posts from "john" who does not give his last name but always gives a "real" email address and has posted on here for years, and Wolfgang did not give his email address in 8 of his posts. Add these 14 posts to the 23 and we have 37, which is still a paltry 24% of the board activity. So 3 out of 4 posts are from people who don't have a need to feel any responsibility for what they post, because they don't reveal who they are.
I don't use an email address because I know there are people out there who are like Dennis's father. I think something like 40 percent of the phone numbers in California are unlisted for a good reason.
bless me father for i have sinned- i assumed a false email address exercising an interperetation of my first amendment right that differs from yours. i beseech your forgiveness for any psychological damage, embarassment, or aneurisms my breach of cyber ettiquette may have caused.
for the most part my contributions include my true email address. on a handful of occasions i have not for a variety of reasons. i believe you and i discussed this via email several months ago. i do not wish to offend anyone here... however, if some insist on taking offense at such little things; i choose not to make it my problem and do not feel compelled to alter my opinions and/or behavior. anyone is free to differ with me on this of course, but please do not respond to this on the presumption that you will to be able to change my mind..
Victor Engel (the webmaster)Bill Choisser (myself)Scott LeigeberRodney McCoySteven WinnerWolfgang SalzmannCharlie Malarkey
That's a bit of an overstatement, Bill. Anyone who wants to know who I am can reconstruct my identity trivially. (Drop the no spam, find a sunysb.edu online directory and you might even find my physical address) I wasn't on your list. I assume that I was one of those that had real email addresses but you couldn't tell my full name. Or I could have been a "pseudo-address" cause of the nospam.
I guess I just take umbrage to the idea that you don't seem to think that I take responsibility for my actions, just because I don't list my email address as Robert.Gauthier@sunysb.edu.
(That is just a pointer to my rgauthie@ic.sunysb.edu account)
I, Robert Gauthier, perpetually failed longhair, of Long Island, NY hereby take full responsibility for all of my posts, especially those where I disparage mullets. Yes, I'm nuts, yes, I have a sad, sad hatred of mullets that I have to try very hard to keep from clouding my view of the handful of decent looking mullets I've seen.
Argh. And I can't seem to get my hair to grow out without cutting it. I think my mullet-hate causes me to despise the hair growing down my back while the front and sides grow out...
You had it right - the former. I counted you among those with "real" e-mail addresses. I even guessed you were probably R. Gauthie. You've been posting on here for a couple of years and I personally count you as a regular who "I feel I know who you are", though I did not know your name. There are a few others who've posted who are like that. What I was pointing out was that among the posts on the board at the time there were only so many that you could tell who the people were - a first name and a last name at a place.
There are some who'd have been counted except that they did not have any messages on the board now. Such as Robert Casper. The point was to get a percentage, and to point out that among all these names a very small percentage are saying who they are. This was in answer to the point raised by "Curious".
Of course I can't say that about any individual. My point is that material as a rule is a heck of a lot less reliable, on average, when the author hasn't signed it, because no one is going to hold him accountable for it. And the numbers of anonymous postings on here are very high. This does not necessarily speak to the reliability of what any individual writes, as you point out. But it does carry a message when applied over a larger number of people (i.e., the board as a whole) because of the way the laws of statistics work, and that, again, is in answer to the question posed by "Curious".
I promise to forever know who you are. You also have the most awesome handle on this board, :-) so we can overlook your not mentioning your name and your general dislike of mullets. This is particularly easy for us to do since you recognize that some mullets are decent just as we recognize so are some anonymous posters. :-) Indeed we must not let typical group characteristics cloud an individual.
Most of us have seen the rants from educators and researchers about how the Internet can be an unreliable source for information. These rants center foremost on not knowing who the source is. And most of us buy into their arguments to some degree because we recognize their concerns are not without foundation. The question for an individual from this discourse would be, "You've gone to all the trouble to type up some information; why not validate your message by signing it?" Do you go to the trouble to write letters and then mail them without stamps? And the question for the board, for our community would be, "Wouldn't we be seen as a better resource if there weren't a lot more 'real people' apparent on here?" Isn't this what "Curious" was in fact asking?
The board allows anonymity. There's a time for it. Most of the stuff in the Dennis thread was anonymous, and most of us believe most of it because we've traveled that road. But "Curious" was pointing out that there were indeed an awful lot of ghosts in there....
Yeah, we love you, Happy Scrappy. You're just a longhair with problems like the rest of us. ((hug))
Bill
I can't fault anyone for not posting their real email address on a board like this. I get too much "Free Cable TV Descrambler" spam as it is.
87 (57%) have no email shown at all17 (11%) have hotmail or similar pseudo-addresses26 (17%) have real addresses but you can't tell their names from them23 (15%) gave real email addresses that indicate their first and last names and a real web connection, or information from which you can actually ascertain who they are including both their first and last names
Victor Engel (the webmaster)Bill Choisser (myself)Scott LeigeberRodney McCoySteven WinnerWolfgang SalzmannCharlie Malarkey
Bill, I think it is not always necessary to give an email adress. If someone else would write something under my name I would complain it. There exist no consistent checks of email adresses. Other boards give the IP-adress, but this doesn't work in all cases. After my experience giving an email adress includes the offer to write something personally to the contributer, without an email adress it's a more general statement. I think one can assume that people are real if their postings are consistent over a longer time. I am sure that bobbedguy, Miaka, Merle Unruh, Curly David ... are real.
Wolfgang
Hi there.
I wanted to point out that there may be good reason for someone not wanting to be recognised in this forum.
In my case, I almost lost my job two years ago because people could have trace in the net my private activities that goes beyong my long hairs. I am also in the freedom of expression about the way we behave according to the dress code in general - I am a skirt and dress wearer during my leasure time (I define myself as an androgen person). Having an administration job in the education field, this was perceive as unacceptable and I had to start to take great care every time I was posting in the net. I feel like walking on tine ice every time I am "showing" myself up and this is why I am very prudent and manage not to leave my name and adress when I do so. This doesn't mean that I am not true, it only mean that I am scare and prudent.
Yours
Jean
Yes, Jean, you have good reasons to be anonymous, and it's good the board allows that option for guys like you. For most guys on here though, the only disapprobation society is throwing their way is that they have long hair, and anyone can see that the minute they look at them. They're not going to reveal anything by being seen on here.
Well my address is for real and I have no probs with that.
Cheers,
John.B.
Wolfgang Salzmann
Victor Engel (the webmaster) [victor@victorengel.com]
Bill Choisser (myself) [bill@choisser.com]
Scott Leigeber [scott.leigeber@ua.edu]
Rodney McCoy [rodney.mccoy2@verizon.net]
Steven Winner [winner@old-dominon.net]
Charlie Malarkey [malarkey@sfgate.com]
I haven't bothered to go through and check it all out, but there are many people who leave no name or E-mail at the haircut site. I think it is just the nature of the internet.
87 (57%) have no email shown at all17 (11%) have hotmail or similar pseudo-addresses26 (17%) have real addresses but you can't tell their names from them23 (15%) gave real email addresses that indicate their first and last names and a real web connection, or information from which you can actually ascertain who they are including both their first and last names
Victor Engel (the webmaster)Bill Choisser (myself)Scott LeigeberRodney McCoySteven WinnerWolfgang SalzmannCharlie Malarkey
It sounds like you have just gone through a completely humiliating experience, Dennis. If my father had done this to me when I was 17, I would have left home and town and cut off all contact with him. He sounds like a very abusive man. My father threatened me with the same thing when I was your age, but my mother's influence managed to save me. The only thing he achieved from these angry threats was to distance me from him and my determination to grow it long and keep it long for much longer than I otherwise would have. You have to get away from this man. I know it will be difficult but you have to go to the authorities and tell them that you are being physically and emotionally abused by your father. You are a young adult and do not deserve to be treated like this. The father son relationship will suffer irrepairably because of what he has done. REMEMBER this is not your fault. I don't know what else to say to you... please just get help. Keep us posted if you can.
So Sorry, Dennis. Hang in ther it will grow back - much good luck...
Dennis: It's obvious that your dad is a messed-up person. You would be wise to get your own income and apartment as soon as you are able. Also, talk to any adults that you trust (teacher, councillors, minister, whoever...) about your situation. It's obviously NOT about your hair, that was just an excuse.
Good luck.
Disregarding whether or not this is a true story or invented tale, it's still sad to know that this kind of thing does actually happen. Makes me thankful to be seventeen and knowing my dad wouldn't go that far (I'm sure he'd like to, though).
Dennis, what happened to you really sucks. I went through the 'hair wars' with my dad in my mid-teens but it never got that far even though he'd have loved nothing more than to see me get a short haircut. I know that this isn't of much comfort to you, but at least short hair is 'in' right now whereas getting a (forced) buzzcut in the 70's was the ultimate humiliation because pretty much every young guy had long hair. Good luck and hopefully in time your father will come to realize the error of his ways and apologize to you and you can forgive him.
Your hair can grow back, but I think your father may have destroyed the father-son relationship forever. Reporting the abuse may be the right thing to do. You need to talk to somebody--maybe a school counselor. The barber who saw your hair may have reported it already, or at least he is a witness.
My biggest concern here really isn't Dennis's hair, which most people on this board would rant and rave about for hours on end. I feel sorry for him that he has to live in that environment. The worst thing is that he is not in control of anything. There is nothing worse in life than being out of control.
I used to work in the medical field and if I encoutered him in person I would be required by law to report suspected child abuse. It is scary stuff and unfortunately it goes on much more than we think.
I seriously don't see how having short hair would help anyone's grades out. I have had all kinds of hair lengths and all kinds of grades and really haven't come to any conclusions.
My advice for Dennis would be to see a guidance councilor or someone like that. Life is hard enough to grow up in and I can't imagine living under the roof of a monster.
I wish you luck with all of this. It seems like there is more to it than what you have told us. All I can say is that if you were my kid I couldn't care less about what your hair looks like. If you have trouble in school then deal with that on its own terms.
Whether or not Dennis is for real, whacking off a kid's hair is not the most heinous form of physical child abuse but it certainly is an egregious form of psychological abuse, which is just as insidious as physical abuse.
Dear Dennis:
Please call the police and a public attorney! Your father has assaulted you with a weapon and he committed a felony! When it comes to breaking the law, there is NO difference between a relative and a stranger. (By the way, he might have clipped of part of your ear during his assault on your body.) Don't think about doing this, DO IT NOW! Your father is a sick man. He cut your hair to show his power over you! So, maybe a few days, or weeks, in jail will cool him off.
This man can't stop himself from harming you! Thus, it is up to you to stop him, from harming you again, or your mother, or your siblings. After all, the next time he attacks you, you might lose more than your hair. Next time, you might lose your life!
If you care nothing about yourself, as least do it for your mother and/or siblings; or, do you want him to put them through the same type of terrorism that you went through?
Get the law, and your relatives, on your side. Stand up for yourself! Above all, don't make any more deals about your hair. In other words, If you act like a sheep, you'll get sheared.
When it comes to haircuts, follow my own rule and "Always say NO!"
Lastly, let us know when your 18th birthday is, so we can all celebrate that special day you are finally free from your father's dictatorship.
Live forever, fellow long hair!
Multi HMX-12
So, what's the verdict? Do we need a recount? Is this a viable, believable posting...I think the jury is still out!
nonwithstanding the factual content of the post i found it to be all too believable. however, there are a couple florida precincts still counting absentee ballots so who knows?