new thread
Oh my, ponytails at work--oh no!....
http://msn.careerbuilder.com/custom/msn/careeradvice/viewarticle.aspx?articleid=1012&SiteId=cbmsnch41012&sc_extcmp=JS_1012_msn&catid=WI&cbRecursionCnt=1&cbsid=0d3b6157549c42c3a219dfcd6d9c71d3-232717393-JP-5
Run! It's a ponytail!
I always find lists like this hilarious. Too many people get over-obsessed with following all of these sorts of rules. Heaven forbid everyone look different!
Oh well, more room for creativity for the rest of you guys.
Mouse
Looking differently is a tip-off that one thinks differently and questions things. It is to the corporate and government powers GREAT advantage that we, the sheeple conform in appearance and thought. Independent looks and thinking indicate that one might question more than fascion... ahhh I mean fashion conventions- it could portend an investigative mind analyzing much of what is being force fed to us as good and legal.
Differing for how one's boss dresses and grooms him or herself may indicate differing with how he/she thinks. God forbid that there be any independent thinkers in the work force.
Those articles are written by some wine pumped gays who don't have a real job.
Sorry for an angry note. Just had to...
If you browse that careerbuilder.com site and look at the other articles that they have posted, you will notice that almost all of them are written by women. I have clicked on about 50 articles and every single one of them was written by a woman. The article you linked to was also the only article I've found on there that doesn't have an author's name listed. Guess why? Because it was written by a woman, and if guys who read the article know it was written by a woman, they won't follow the advice. Notice how it starts out "Dude..." meaning they are trying to make men who read it think that it's the viewpoint of a fellow "dude" and appeal to the innate human need to conform to peer pressure, which is stronger among the same sex.
This article was just written by some woman who gets a trip out of being able to control men and control what they look like.
Sunflower
I worked in Corporate America for a number of years and, yeah...if you want to climb the ladder as high as you can then you must take that list seriously. It's a sad fact of corporate life. Botox, face lifts, nips/tucks, hair styles, trendy designer clothing...all that crap...is not just for Hollywood stars or news broadcasters. Those industries are HUGE because lots of business professionals HAVE to take drastic measures like those to impress the right people that control how successful you are. I can't tell you how many obvious boob jobs I've seen on women of corporate power. An impressive resume is almost never #1 when getting a corporate job. Everybody is entitled to an interview no matter what. Looks and the type of dialog you have with key people are most important. If you don't care about an impressive job title then that list is a complete joke...except for the excessive cologne/perfume part. That's a serious matter. NOBODY can stand that.
I wanted to add that the corporation I worked at in San Jose had a number of long hairs employed and one in particular was extremely high up the ladder. Long ponytail kept really neat and the dude wore nice suits and had a goatee. So, having a pony tail is not just for wizards and rock stars. Although men need to pay some attention to their appearance in corporate America they don't even have it as bad as women do. "fair" is not in the corporate vocabulary...in the real world.
1. Backpacks. OK, maybe this is just a misdemeanor, but you're trying to climb the corporate ladder, not hike up a mountain. Carry a briefcase or messenger bag -- and if you need something for your gym clothes -- invest in a nice-looking gym bag.
- I actually agree with this one. Of course, that's only if you work in an office. Otherwise, who cares?
2. Clashing or too many colors. A coat of many colors may have worked for Joseph, but you, my friend, should limit each outfit to just three colors or shades. Stick to complementary colors (those opposite from each other on the color wheel) or colors from the same pallet. Match pale clothes with light-colored shoes and dark clothes with dark shoes.
- Most men are more likely not to wear enough different colours, or to only wear ghastly shades of brown and grey. This does tend to indicate a woman wrote this. I wear bright solid coloured shirts and neutral coloured trousers to work mostly, which would almost comply with this if I ever bothered to match my shoes to anything, but I know that nobody would consider my shirts to be conservative, which is another reason that I think that this couldn't have been written by a man.
3. Stained clothes. Don't be that guy who's unwittingly walking around with red sauce on his shirt. Make it part of your daily routine to inspect your clothes when you take them off and when they come out of the wash to make sure you don't miss a spot. Watch for yellow circles under the armpits, soiled collars or cuffs. You may even want to keep a stain stick in your desk at work.
- Guilty, and yes it does look awful, but a stain stick in the desk?
4. Ill-fitting pants. Even if you're sure of your size, always try on pants before buying them, because different brands have different lengths. Jeans can be worn to the bottom of your heel, but your khakis or dress pants should end at the top of the heel. Make sure they don't reveal any sock as you walk-- or more than a couple of inches of sock when you sit. Too tight or too baggy won't cut it either.
- oh no, not showing the fluorescent lime green socks!!! Who cares, anyway?
5. Ponytails. You're neither a wizard nor a rock star. And even if you were, admit it, doesn't Michael Bolton look much better now that he's cut his hair? If you must keep your hair long, make sure it's neat and clean and doesn't fall past the base of your neck.
- They have got to be kidding: long but above the base of the neck? That's not even long enough to be called short! Unless they mean we have to wear buns instead of ponytails? Yes, that must be it. No thanks, though.
6. Novelty ties. It's okay to express your individuality through color or pattern. But stick with the classic width of about three-and-one-quarter inches and make sure the colors and patterns complement the shirt you are wearing. And one more thing: When it comes to how a tie hangs, it should reach the top of your belt buckle and have a dimple in the center of the knot.
- No tie required here, and this is a law firm!
7. Too much cologne. If you must wear cologne, get a quality brand. And since the same cologne smells different on each person, make sure to test it out and get some opinions. Beware of mixing too many smells at once. Remember, if you wear an anti-perspirant or aftershave, the scents can mingle for an unpleasant effect. And don't be too liberal in your application. The safest bet is to avoid wearing cologne all together and let the clean smell of soap do the talking.
- I have worked places where someone complained about someone's aftershave or perfume, so maybe there's something to this. Mind you, the person complaining was always female, even if the 'offending party' could just as well be either sex.
8. Funky facial hair. If you're going to do facial hair, do it right. Keep any mustache or beard trimmed. Don't wear a soul patch (that little rectangle of unshaven hair beneath your lower lip) or uni-brow (try waxing or laser hair removal). If you're prone to stray nose or ear hairs, please invest in a special trimmer.
- Have you ever heard of a guy getting his brow waxed? Neither have I.
9. Too much jewelry. A simple watch is all you need outside of a wedding band or class ring, if appropriate. Save the gold neck chains, bracelets, pinky rings and facial piercings for after hours.
- Again, it's rare to see guys draped with tons of jewellry, that's usually just something that some women do. This is obviously the editted version of the female version of the list.
And the most heinous crime of all:
10. Comb-overs. Draping or otherwise "arranging" those nine hairs on top of your head into an elaborate comb-over doesn't actually work for Donald Trump. He only gets away with it because he's the boss. If you are follicly-challenged, embrace it. Keep your hair cropped short, or shave it all a la Michael Jordan, Andre Agassi or Howie Mandel.
- Trump's hair does look awful. OTOH, my dad used to employ a guy with a combover. It didn't make any difference to the way he treated him, and to suggest that it would or should is just silly.
If you walk a long distance to work, or if you ride a crowded train, you need a daypack. On a crowded train you need both hands to hold on. Carrying something in one hand or over one shoulder is not good for your spine if you walk very far. Now, a backpack, I can agree with. If you have that much homework, you oughta be working at home.
My boss once asked me, "What do you have in that thing?" I said,
"The same things you have in your briefcase. I don't drive to work like you do, I walk or take the train. A briefcase is not practical if you have to carry it very far. You lay yours on the back seat."
Those purple pants and that lavender shirt I saw last week in a store window on Haight Street should be just fine, then. [grin]
Yeah, I'd agree. When I get on the subway train, I am surrounded by bleak grays and blacks. Mostly blacks. Sometimes I'm the only one on the train that would not be rendered the same if photographed in black and white. Sometimes I'm a blaze of color. I like that!
How the hell am I gonna do that? Stand over a blower grate all day so my hair goes straight up? "Falling" is gravity's fault, not mine.
With a full beard, your soul patch will blend in and not create this offense. And I have lots of ear hairs, but no one ever lifts my mane to see if I have them. Nose hairs, yeah, I remove those.
Now this one is actually practical, if you work with electricity. Jewelry conducts electricity, and it always finds a way to come into contact with live parts!
Bill (retired electrical engineer)
I guess you do have a point avout backpacjs after all, although I think the whole briefcase thing started beoire people had cars.
I have a wedding ring that won't come off. but I got married after I was no longer working at a test bench. I guess I would have to cover it with a sticking plaster!
On top of everything others have posted these articles are also made to make people spend money. The fashion industry wouldnt be as big as it is if people weren't made to feel inferior for being different or actually having their own sense of style. I don't give a shit if I am 'offending the eyes of my colleagues'.
Just like the metrosexual fad was used to foist new wardrobes and facial cleansers to men. They don't care about how you do in your career they only want you to spend money even if its on credit and you're going bankrupt.
FYI, I break 'rules' # 1, 3, 4, 5, 9(I don't wear watches, only a meditation bead bracelet and a necklace) and sometimes 2 when I feel like it.
Another thing that needs to be mentioned is not everyone works in a office environment. Give these rules to a artist or a construction worker and they'll laugh in your face. I work in a office and we are looking for new hire, a guy came in yesterday for a interview and he looked the part(followed these rules to a t) and we did not hire him. Incompetence is incompetence even if its dressed nicely and presented in a 'professional' manner.
Jonathan Schwartz about that one. He is the CEO of Sun Microsystems. He is obviously very successful.
Absalom
Not to mention loads of other people in the computer engineering/software industry. Steve Wozniak used to have fairly long hair, I believe, though he doesn't anymore. He's also always had a splendid beard.
Same goes for Steve Jobs, who used to sport the stereotypical hippie look. Sadly, he dropped all that as Apple grew as a company. He's grown his beard back, though. :)
Have you seen the 1999 made-for-TV movie "Pirates of the Silicon Valley" about the rise of Apple and Microsoft? The film showed the difficulties Jobs went through trying to get bank loans to start Apple Computer. He was a long haired and bearded hippie getting the door slammed in his face everywhere he went so he cut his hair and shaved his beard to be taken more seriously. As he put it "banks don't like beards".
I'm looking at my copy on my DVD shelf right now. Surprisingly good for a made-for-TV docudrama. Woz has said it captured events pretty well, and brought across the general feel of the times in a way that totally surprised him, even if they did make a buncha stuff up. ;)
I was told Asus doesnt have policy against long hair... of course assuming I could work for them....
I hate how everyone's always trying to tell you how to look good. Most of the time when you see these fashion freaks, they're wearing something that makes them look ridiculous anyway. Just turn it to the style channel on tv and you can see what I mean. This is why everyone is so self conscious about how they look nowadays, the media beats it into people like it's necessary to look like everyone else. And apparently it's working because it seems like it gets worse every year.
I have seen this list before. It really makes me seethe to read crap like this. What gives them the right to decide what is correct or "proper" or "professional"? F...'em. Longhairs will never succumb to corporate pressure. We're proud to be ourselves, independent and free forever!
yup
The thing that gets me is that the media tends to focus on office/corporate work enviroments and the rules that go along with them almost exclusively. There are tons of other jobs out there where people don't give a rip whether you wear a ponytail or not. Take construction for example, you a have good mix of totally messy, unkept looking guys and cleancut, nicely dressed dudes. Besides these are the guys who build the office towers the corporate drones work in.
Corporate America is the one that gets all the limelight to the detriement of other people. When is the stupid media going to focus on janitors, store clerks or landscapers. Those are the people the economy is built on the backs of. Corporate America just skims the cream off the top.
1. Backpacks.
I don't use backpacks. That is what my car is for.
2. Clashing or too many colors.
I usually where two at the most. Black jeans/Blue jeans and
a shirt.
3. Stained clothes. Don't be that guy who's unwittingly walking around with red sauce on his shirt.
Me thinsk someone never spilled anything at lunch.
4. Ill-fitting pants. Even if you're sure of your size, always try on pants before buying them, because different brands have different lengths. Jeans can be worn to the bottom of your heel, but your khakis or dress pants should end at the top of the heel. Make sure they don't reveal any sock as you walk-- or more than a couple of inches of sock when you sit. Too tight or too baggy won't cut it either.
Mmany of my jeans are JNCO type jeans that touch the floor.
(Wide leg, 30" to 60"). Or Levis, Lee, etc. Oh and I often
wear shorts (19" to 21" long). Or cut off jeans.
Also some of my jeans have holes in them like the knees.
Ultimately my attitude is if you're an employer and you're going
to dictate that I wear something like a suit/shirt and tie/etc.
then you as an employer better be prepared to pay me
$160,000 a year with full benefits. Since I don't I don't
get paid that kind of money the employer can shove it.
5. Ponytails. You're neither a wizard nor a rock star. And even if you were, admit it, doesn't Michael Bolton look much better now that he's cut his hair? If you must keep your hair long, make sure it's neat and clean and doesn't fall past the base of your neck.
Sorry my pony tail is waist length. Tough potatoes.
6. Novelty ties.
I never do ties. Ever.
7. Too much cologne.
I don't do cologne.
8. Funky facial hair.
Have a mustace and sometimes a beard.
9. Too much jewelry. A simple watch is all you need outside of a wedding band or class ring, if appropriate. Save the gold neck chains, bracelets, pinky rings and facial piercings for after hours.
I don't do jewelry except my wedding ring. Don't need a
watch, get my time from my cell phone. Hated high school
so I never got a class ring.
10. Comb-overs.
I don't have to worry about that. I've got a full head of hair.
I'm a psychologist, living in a place where not so many men wear long hair and beard, It's like it is reserved for artist or rock-stars.
At this moment (during the akward phase, finally getting through it) I'm working as a hospital as a Clinical Psych, and dress codes and things like that are not so important and I'm ok with it.
But on december I have to leave the place and I need to find another work, it might be a school, all of them with strict dress codes, an office or, if I'm lucky, on another place inside the same hospital.
The thing is that I will face the social thing about long haired, there is no way I'm cutting my hair in request of my employee, but I cannot be unemployed. This will happen on january 2008, but I'm thinking it now.
I wonder if any of you guys got any idea in how to deal with it?
Restav
Open your own office? Well, I know if you are a psychologist and not a psychiatrist you can't prescribe drugs, except perhaps in a few enlightened parts of the world. I'm sure I have seen a psychologist with his own office, though. There are people who want psychotherapy and don't need to be doped up. Quite a few, actually.