new thread
I've been following this forum for quite some time, but I just never felt the need to really introduce myself. I'm Eric by the way. For the moment I don't have a scanner of sorts since I am using my parents computer and they forbid me from sending my pictures in public(overprotective I know but there are perverts out there so I understand), so I unfortunately for the moment can't show you guys any pictures for the moment. You'll just have to take my word for it, my hair is currently to my waist and I may decide to keep growing it longer, perhaps terminal length. I have been growing it for the past seven years and I love how it looks and feels on me.
However, I also happen to be unemployed at the moment. I am attempting to be an up and coming hairstylist. How ironic isn't it, I want to cut hair for a living and yet I wish to keep my own long, LOL. Although, I prefer to do long haircut styles so I guess that doesn't make me that much of a hypocrite LOL. Anyway today, I happened to do an interview in a particularly posh salon where at the end, I was told that I could only get the job if I cut off my hair. And I mean all of it as in a short man's haircut, the male interviewer(who also is part owner he and his wife run the shop) wanted to donate 20 inches of my hair. Keep in mind that I have been searching all over my city, I mean I lost count at over 20 other hair salons which all also didn't hire me. I do have a license to practice cosmetology and I did graduate from a training school, so skill wise I know I'm qualified. It pains me because I "know" that its because of my hair that prevents me from getting the job I want to have. If you're asking me why I don't try another line of work, its because I know from since I was a child that styling hair was what I wanted to do. And in any case, even if I were to convince myself into going into another profession I still would most very likely be told to cut off all my hair as well since long hair these days is unpopular for men in general as you all know.
So my simple question is, do you guys believe I should indeed give in to cutting my hair in the name of conformity? I obviously don't want to, but for my career it may be a required evil. It is unfair that if I were the opposite gender this wouldn't be an issue and I would be allowed to have long hair. But as I said, I am unemployed and I do wish to get a job in this field. Have any of you had to make this same difficult decision? And have any of you really cut your hair for your career? If so was it the right decision or do you now regret it? I'd like to know so I can get a well-rounded answer from you guys because I don't want to cut off my hair, but if I really have no choice if I want to succeed in my profession of choice I will just have to do it.
I currently have NOT cut my hair still and will continue to look for work at other salons in the meanwhile, but if I get no where I just might have to go to the scissors. :.( Please give me your honest opinions.
Have you thought about moving somewhere else? If you can't find work where you are, it's not the only town in the world.
Have you tried researching salons that specialise in long hair? There are some, although seldom more than one in any particular area.
No at the current moment, I finished training school not that long ago and I still am dependent on my parents. I have no money of my own.
And the thing is, whereas all salons will accept clients with long hair, they won't accept their hairstylists to have long hair at least not any I've been to. I just don't think there are any places that will accept men stylists having long hair.
" I just don't think there are any places that will accept men stylists having long hair."
Well, there are...I, for one, (a professional stylist/salon owner) would accept male stylists having long hair in my men's grooming center (if they were trained and had a good personality)...so keep looking...and please do not cut your hair in the meantime...you will regret it.
P.S. I do not know where you are located, but do contact me directly if you think I can be of further help.
Call Bruce he's a nice guy and does hnor chop hair for the sake od it...eh trimmers!!!
Thank you BRGallagher. It is a relief for me to know that there is at least one place that would not discriminate me for my hair length of choice. I live in NYC(in the borough of Brooklyn). If it would be alright with you I can tell you my e-mail address if you believe you can offer some assistance. And even if you don't have connections in NYC that's alright too, I would enjoy chatting with a fellow longhair.
Eric, use the MLHH directory connection (through my user name: BRGallagher) to send me your email address...and we will go from there
BRGallagher, my e-mail address is eric7145@yahoo.com.
Anywho I just wanted to say hi and if you believe have any helpful tips I'll be happy to be open to them. I won't be moving anywhere outside my city though if that may be one of your suggestions. I am adamantly a strict New Yorker, I went away to upstate NY for my freshman year at a SUNY and even being in the same state, I still felt homesick the entire time there and came home after the Spring term. I'm just not the type to up and pack my things to a strange place, I need to be in familiar surroundings and around the people I know. So if you have any connections to NYC or if you just have some helpful advice about how to present myself and what to say and do, please my ears are open!
How strong are you. Do you want freedom or the money that is so quickly being deflated. How creative are you. Can you earn money another way than working for the system? Waist length hair? Hmmm "I" wouldn't give it up.
Hummm I guess I'll find out how strong I am in the next few weeks. I just wish that people didn't judge on appearance, I mean you should be judged for your skills and your knowledge and if you have a good personality right?
true, I would agree. sadly you will find in life that others do not do so, even if they do not admit it...
you should be judged for your skills and your knowledge and if you have a good personality right
Welcome, Eric.
I went from college into the workforce with long hair, and getting started in a career can be a real pain in the butt, with or without a mane. Was for me. I'm in computers now, which is pretty receptive to longhairs, so I've not been exactly in your place- honestly I did have a lot of pressure to cut it to get a quick job when I was fresh out of school and looking for work (majored in History, btw- but didn't want to be a HS teacher), but hairstyling in computers tends to be "is it blocking your view of the screen?" sort of thing :) it worked out in the end for me. :D
Actually, I think it's totally cool and completely natural that someone with long hair wants to "do" hair for a living. In your post you said "it's ironic I want to cut hair", but while cutting is a part of it you want (I presume) to help folks look their best via their 'do, and that's great. Some folks may be best with a long huge mane and some with a shorter styley cut- the world is better off with a stylist who can honestly figure that out. Damn, if you've been reading this place for a while you know how many of us are afraid (with reason!) to get our split ends cut off by a stylist because they've screwed us over again and again by cutting off WAY more than they should have! We'd trust you, man, with a long mane. ;)
One of the previous posters recommended looking further afield- I think that's good advice. Uprooting is a big thing, but plenty of folks before you have done that to pursue their dreams. It does takes some thinking over, but it might be for you. BTW, some of the smartest people I know have done that very thing.
Another thing to think on- you're young and just starting out. There are zillions (ok, exaggeration, lotsa), folks who did something else for a few years before they were able to move into exactly what their dreams were. Realistically, it happens to a lot of us. I'm not sayin' to abandon your dreams, here, just that sometimes they are delayed, just an option...
P.S. I think it's really screwy and suspect that styling places would require conformative male haircuts. In truth, I have no idea how the hair sytling business works, that just seems really weird.
Feel free to post more questions you may have, and let us know how you fare. You're always welcome here, no matter what happens.
-sectari
I understand that you feel dependent on your parents, but like the saying goes...."When there's a will, there's a way." There are people who don't think they can affort to go (or go away to) college, but many find a way. There are thousands of salons across the country. You will find a way if this is really what you want to do.
How do you wear your hair when you go to interviews? Do you wear it down? Maybe they would percieve a better "first impression" if you had your hair pulled back in some way. Maybe even an appropriate bun. You're the stylist, so you could get creative. I'm sure most salons are looking for a "polished" look. Also consider the clothes. Maybe you could give them what they're looking for even with your long hair.
And yes, there are male stylists out there with long hair. Some of them are doing quite well. Here is a site with pictures of Tom Sebastian (just copy and paste it )http://www.tomsebastian.nl/content/pics/index.php?level=album&id=1
I would think that under the right circumstances, a salon would find your hair an asset. You might even get some long haired men into the salon to get those split-end trimmed ;-)
You say you'd like to specialize in long hair. Have you considered getting trained in the George Micheal method? I believe he is retired now living in Florida, but they still do training at the main salon in New York City.
Stylists around here must intern in a salon as part of their certification. The salon I go has hired many of it's interns.
Did your trainers/teachers in your program ever indicate to you that you might have trouble getting a job with your long hair?
I wish you luck. You're future is in YOUR hands.
Hi Eric and welcome to the mlhh being what seems like a longtime lurker.First of all it sounds like you have quite a fantastic mane at waist length as thats where I am at right now.As far as your job situation I think Mike and sectari both gave you great responses as I could hardly add more to what they said.I can say however that I too had a job offer many years ago that had a "cut your hair"requirement attached to it.Well since I already had on the job experience I politely declined that offer based solely on that request.The job would have been an upgrade for me but hey a couple years later I had another opportunity for the same position but with another company and they never made me cut my hair:)Since I work in the HVAC field I had to sign a waiver should I be injured due to my hair length but I was fine with that.Anyway I hope you don't cut your hair for a first time job because I know what kind of time is invested in growing hair to your waist.Keep the faith my friend and let us know how you make out with this.
Mark
I'm not sure where you are, but here in Virginia, you can hardly go past a shopping center that does not have a "Help Wanted" sign in the window of a salon. Jobs are plentiful, and the going rate seems to be good. We simply don't have a supply of good stylists (or barbers) in this area.
My first inclination is that there is something other than the hair that is keeping you from getting a position. What have your references from your cosmetology school said about you? Do these prospective employers call the school for recommendations?
Long hair can worn very neatly (and is often a sign of true individuality). Do you think the salons don't want what they perceive as someone who is avant-garde working for them? What are you wearing to the interviews? Even with the long hair, professional attire is expected at the interview and subsequent visits to personnel offices.
Just wanted to give you something to think about as you pursue your professional goals.
I would love to see more men involved in the industry to help us keep ourselves looking the best we can... and to avoid the scissor happy nuts out there..
Thank you for all of your helpful responses. For now at least, I will definitely NOT be cutting my hair. I know, that means kissing that job offer goodbye but I see from your replies here that in life you have to make tough decisions. On the moving part, I live in NY and wouldn't dream of moving, I really am a home body all my friends and acquaintances are all here. Hell, I did actually go away to college for my freshman year and let me tell you I came running back home come Spring term vowing never to move away from my fair city ever again And why would I, its NY for crying out loud!! I'm just not good being alone in an unfamiliar place. I have no money of my own anyway and my parents certainly won't foot the bill for me to move elsewhere. As I am still completely dependent on my parents at the moment, I'm more or less limited to what I'm doing right now or going back to college to learn another field of work. I have just graduated from training school so of course I never had previous experience in a previous salon. I'm caught in the classic catch-22, you need to have had a job to get another job. As for how I present myself, I always wear white buttoned up shirts, black pants and leather shoes to interviews and my hair is tied back in a low ponytail. It really is because I have long hair, I know it. I'm not about to give up on my dream yet, I will search for more salons in my area. If worse comes to worse, I suppose I'll look into waitering or cashiering someplace for a a temporary job.
wear a wig if u really want the job. You can make double braids on the sides of ur head and then pin them up. This will flatten ur hair and u can then wear a wig on top of that. works for me :)
There have been any number of people on this site who have cut their hair for a job ( or a girlfriend or other reason) and then regretted it. On top of that, they lose their job (or broke up with their girlfriend, etc) a few months later. Just be sure this is what you really want to do if you cut your hair for the job.
man yours is a do or die situation and i guess most of us longhairs have to face it one way or the other in our lives well i would suggest keep looking for the salons that will accept u without a cut but if u fail to do so and there really isnt any other way out than thats dire circumstances and u cut your hair because u need to get the living but u can always grow it back remebering that one day u become a well known stylist noone will care about your hair anymore it will be just your name they will be seeking for so once u get in the market u earn yourself a good name and make your position and goodwill than u can grow it all back but right now its either your career or your hair the wise thing right now is the career than grow it all back again
goodluck man keep us updated about yourself
Eric, though I want to beleive your dilemna is for real, this whole situation strikes me as odd and not a little paradoxical. You live in New York City, you are a licensed cosmetologist/barber, and you have very long hair, well-maintained I'm sure. Something does not add up. New York and L.A. are supposedly the most avant-garde cities in the US. I've seen celebrity stylists like Paul Mitchell (as in the shampoo line) who has a pony tail, as well as the guy that Mick mentioned. For a hiring salon owner to ask you as a male stylist to cut all his hair off into a short, typically male haircut seems like one of the most alogical things ever I have heard. Are males with long hair who visit the salon turned away because this salon does not serve such men? I would imagine not. What could be the reason for requiring a male stylist to have short, super-short, hair? Does the salon owner believe that all guys who come in to the salon want to leave with short hair? I cannot imagine this to be the case. Shaggy length hair is still popular, and it could be debated that its popularity is growing. Medium length cuts are, in my opinion, becoming more the norm lately, just from TV commericals, programs, and movies I see. Long hair for men we know is not common, but is not so rare as to be seen as an oddity, certainly not. The clincher, the irrationality of a salon owner telling a male stylist to cut his hair hinges on this precept: with any business, the objective is to please the customer, without this, the business will fail quickly. As the salon goes about pleasing its male customers, if they are to please them, all males who enter in will not leave with short hair cuts. Lengths will vary according to the customers' wishes. Slight trims, layers, radical shortenings, etc. What gives with any salon owner asking a potential employee to sacrifice his hair against his own personal wishes when this is not, and cannot ever be, what happens to the customer? I honestly don't understand what's going on here.
I do know however that if you cut your hair against your will and better judgment, you will regret it. You will not stay at this job. The resentment will build, your ire will fester, and your anger from your coercion will triumph over your happiness at having found a job. The victory of financial gain will be quite phyrric. Take my word on that.
Good luck.
MB
Yeah, I smelled a rat here, too. Rats flee the rising water on a sinking ship, and with all the floods this week, rising water is also driving trolls out from under bridges.
My gut reaction was that this post was not written by a man with long hair. Why?
1. Any man whose hair is down to his waist and has been growing long hair for seven years knows how to deal with hair bigots, or he would have never gotten his hair to there.
2. It mentions hair donation, a common troll topic and one almost never mentioned by longhairs.
3. There are more perverts running around a big city than he'll ever encounter on a small web board. Get real. If you have been a longhair for seven years, you dealt with that about six years ago. He's of age, so people who want to date him are not "perverts" anyway. Grownups are fair game in the dating game, and also, grownups know how to say "no" to those they are not interested in.
4. It mentions hair cutting. Sure, the beautician angle was a clever way to work that in, but lots of trolls mention hair cutting. We have a general policy here of not posting submissions from strangers whose posts mention haircutting. There is a reason for that - almost all are fantasy and they waste our users' time to "support" someone who is role-playing a fantasy. Posting fantasy without identifying it as such is a rule violation. I saw this one sit in the moderation queue for quite a while, which usually means several moderators passed on judging it before one thought it might be okay. "You'll just have to take my word for it," he says, but that ain't the way it is. We don't "have to".
5. It mentions the cutting tool, "scissors". Few longhairs would ever mention the means of cutting off their hair. That image turns on trolls, but longhairs usually will just say they are going to cut it. (Maybe bringing up perverts was not as off base as it first appeared.)
6. It gives a silly reason for not being able to show it's not fantasy by posting his picture. Any city has lots of places one can post to the Internet besides at mommy's house.
7. It talks like there is nowhere to work. Any longhair knows he may have to look at several places, and there are surely hundreds if not thousands within walking distance of the subway. And oh, by the way, "up and coming" workers don't land jobs at "posh salons". It's not the hair, dude, it's the lack of experience.
Would any one of those items listed above make the post suspect? Not heavily so. But rolling so many of them into one post makes this one a classic.
Bill
Now that I think about it, I probably wouldn't have made a good fit at this particular salon. The man who was interviewing me has a shaved head. His wife also has a short haircut, its one of those asymmetrical haircuts you know one side is long and the other short. LOL I guess I should have figured that once he saw me, I stood out like a sore thumb. The salon is known for its trendy innovative haircuts and colors, you know with razor cuts and textured choppy cuts with bold highlights. Its not really the kind of place for someone with extra long hair who keeps it natural and never colors it(like me). Not that they would reject such a client if one were to walk in, but they cater to the "I'm gonna change my color every month" kinda crowd. I guess now I'm not so bummed that I am rejecting this job offer. I still do wish that more men would grow their hair to waist length at least or even to terminal length. The maximum length that seems to be acceptable in general society for a man to have is shoulder length with shaggy layers and bangs. Of course for someone like me, shoulder length would be quite short. I am glad to know I'm finally not alone. I will continue to update everyone here if I've made any progress in my job hunt!
Perhaps too you might consider updating us with a photo of yourself?
Yeah, there are 229 longhairs in our users' directory, and every one of them has survived the imaginary evil of posting one's picture. Every time you go out of your house, more people see you are a man with long hair than will ever see it from a picture you post here. There is no closet for longhairs, and the need to be open about it, everywhere we go, is something we all share and is something that defines us that transcends hair length.
Bill
LOL alright guys if I get the chance I will go out and look around if any internet cafes in my area or some public places do have the devices to take my picture and send it here. I'm really not joking, I don't have a scanner and as far as I live under my parents roof I'm not allowed to send photos of myself.
These are his parents' rules, regardless of his age. He has rules to live by as long as he's under their roof and eating their food.
When he moves out and is independent, then he'll make all the choices for himself.
I respect him for honoring this agreement, and honoring his parents. I wish more young men did.
I would like to address any members here who have any doubts about my sincerity. I am definitely not making any of this up. The reason I decided to come forward into this forum is precisely because I am going through a real crisis in deciding what I should do. I would never suggest or even hint to anyone else here what they should or shouldn't do with their hair. I came here simply because I was finally asked point blank to cut my hair if I wanted to be hired, and I wanted to ask the informed opinions of those who would know exactly how I feel. I should have elaborated further...the interviewer expressed his bottom line to me. He emphatically told me that in his opinion having a short, conservative man's haircut is the only way I would be taken seriously in any professional beauty salon. It certainly would be a requirement if I were to work in his shop. I know we can get into trivial details and say that so and so wears a long ponytail and he is a successful stylist, but I can think we can agree that they are the exception and not the rule. And even though I try to put on a strong front, I still do feel a sting in my heart when I get stared at by random people on the street. You know that people are looking at you and they don't approve of you having long hair. Yes even after seven years, I still do sometimes feel that way. I do apologize if my posting seemed at all like a troll post, that certainly was not my intention. What was and still is my intention is simply to know how you guys have dealt or would deal with the matter of choosing between your career or your individuality.
I get just the opposite reaction often enough. I was out in a mall (a place I loathe but needed to visit) the other day when this lady probably in her 50's gave me the biggest smiling stare of approval that fankly amazed me. I had another lady wanting to touch my hair another day. People do approve of me having long hair, even if it is sometimes tacit. People call me "sir" and hold doors for me.
I chose to take a different carreer direction a few years ago indirectly as a result of a choice I had to make about cutting or keeping my hair. I cut it, but that was the last straw to confirm to myself what I deep-down knew to be true, that I was in the wrong field for my personality and talents. I was in banking which doesn't really reward stark individuality or long hair ;-). I'm not anymore. However, your situation is different. I don't honestly know what I would do.
Your initial post when compared to all the others seems like it was made by a different person, but IP numbers (the "other posts" link) don't lie....
In looking it all over, it seems to me that your initial post was largely not you speaking, it was the hair bigots whose line you had been buying. They were speaking through you, and the post's multiple personality origins are what made it seem incongruous.
Your posts after that indicate an acceptance that there are many different cultures, and that you realize you need to find your niche in one in which you fit. For one thing, I'd ask how many longhair friends do you have? Such friends will get you on the road to accepting yourself much faster than you can do it on your own. For another, a longhair who accepts himself as such would not care if anyone sees his picture as a longhair, and he'd "throw the finger" at some level at any anti-longhair bigots like the salon guys you talked about and just move on. The attitude is, "I'm here, I'm hairy, and dude, that ain't gonna change." Once you reek of that attitude, that will shut up all but the nuttiest bigots, and those we just ignore.
Everyone will not love you, no matter who you are, but some people will. On the other hand, no one loves a fake. So just be yourself, and you'll do the best you can do.
Good luck,
Bill
Thank you Bill for giving me a fair shake, I completely understand your instinct to protect this forum from unknown posters who might be trolling. I do happen to be one the kind strangers out there LOL. I've always been a loner even since grade school, so I only have about four people I can truthfully confide in as real friends. None of them are my peers. Two of them are women, so long hair acceptance is not an issue for them, and the two guys are older black men. One of them is retired. Neither of them are longhairs, but that doesn't matter to me they clearly don't judge me and value what's important about me and that's my ability to carry on an intelligent conversation. But no I have no longhair companions. And my particular neighborhood in Brooklyn is rather on the conservative side, I think I can practically count on my hand how many longhairs I've seen around here. I am working on building pride in myself, still it does pains me when I get disapproving stares. Once, some teenage brats even shouted to me "Cut your hair!" to which I ignored them publicly to their face but inside I felt hurt. I suppose it builds character, but for the moment I still do feel hurt when I hear/see hateful comments directed at me.
You just have to decide which is more important to you. You may want to have a talk with the owner of the salon and explain your situation to them and see how they feel about it still. They may not understand how important your hair is to you. Although it may just come down to deciding between your hair and you job. Hopefully it won't though.
Don't cut your hair. Its taken you a long time to grow it. Your hair is part of you. I was in a similar situation with regard whether to cut my hair to get a job. In each case I didn't and felt better for not doing so.
Not sure if this would work, but have you thought of wearing a short haired wig for the job interviews? It would be interesting to see their reactions to short hair. Of course it should be a good quality wig that doesn't look fake. If they hire you, you can stop wearing it and there is nothing they can do.
Of course their is something they could do....they can fire him.
Why would an employer continue to employ someone who was dishonest from the start?