new thread
Hi Guys,
Sorry I'm so late in commenting on John B's Easter thread, below; but rather than get into it this late in the game, I'd just mostly like to say that I thoroughly enjoyed reading everyone's comments (including the many diplomatically-worded disagreements with each other) -- EXCELLENT points made there by all, I'd say!
And a special thank you to Bill for his Easter cartoon, which made it hard for me to stop laughing... OMG, that drawing is just over-the-top!!
Re. longhair humor (or as they spell it over in the UK, "humour" - LOL): I think there's always a bit of the "mischief-maker" in many of us that have ever had to endure some grief over having our hair being so long. Longhairs also tend to be a very opinionated group (myself included), as well as can be quite passionate about our own beliefs -- certainly nobody that's made of milk-toast here at MLHH (LOL)!!
Here's a short fun story about my own family's weird sense of humor, including poking fun at religious beliefs that my brothers and I grew up with:
Going through the process of divorce and coming out to my family as a gay man during the late '80s, I was riding along in my brother and sister-in-law's car when she started asking me questions about my more current views on my former religion. Bare in mind that Rosemary (my sister-in-law) is a very outspoken Atheist -- including the fact that her parents even raised her an Atheist! My brothers and I, however, were raised in the Christian Science church. Our conversation in the car went something like this...
Rosemary: "So Ken, do you still go to church?"
Me: "No, I've had enough of the politics there, so I'm no longer interested."
Rosemary: "But do you still read or believe in any of the church teachings?"
Me: "Oh yeah, sure, I still enjoy reading the Bible now & then, as well as Mrs. Eddy's writings, because I still believe the teachings are of value."
Rosemary: "So, what you're really saying here is: you're no longer willing to put up with the crap of belonging to a church, but yet you still believe that shit!"
My brother, Bruce (in sarcastic mocked shock): "ROSEMARY, such language!!"
I laughed, because I genuinely found Rosemary's comment to be both insightful, as well as very very funny -- and that pretty much explains where some of my own humor comes from... as well as why I can totally understand Jason's comments about why he still believes in many of the Christian teachings, even though he no longer goes to the JW church.
Life is full of irony sometimes. And we are also all very complex human beings, with many uniquely strange and exotic different personal histories included -- which is why it's always a good idea never to take another's comments or statements not originally meant to offend, all too seriously.
This doesn't mean that we should be reckless in whatever we say to another; just that cultivating a sense of humor -- especially re. our own selves & our most cherished beliefs -- is worth the price of getting along, and in keeping our joy in life.
"Onward & downward!
- Ken in San Francisco
PS - I always enjoy reading your comments & posts, too!!
Hey Ken,
I like your comment that none of us here at MLHH are made of milk toast.
As longhaired guys each of us, to one degree or another have had to "pay our dues" for our choice of hair length. I also agree with you that we tend to be opinionated; I know that I am. For many, our hair length has some religious meaning/significance. Religion, religious conviction runs deep in each of us, even our atheist brothers.
We, longhairs value self-expression. We respect in in others and we expect it for ourselves. I know that we can express disagreements with each other and do so with passion and zeal. Yet, we do so with respect for each other and never demeaning or embarassing a brother longhair. Afterall, there are plenty of shorthairs who already do that. We can express our opinions and feelings about religious convictions with zeal and passion just as we do our hair and still feel respect and love for each other. This will make our fraternity even stronger.
Raymond
Ken,
Like Validus stated, very well said. I always enjoy your lengthy responses.
I found my belief in my religion was a great protection when I was attacked spirtually by an evil spirit. My beliefs still hold true for that reason
Glinka
I know that sometimes I have "the gift of gab", in that I can definitely be a little long-winded at times (LOL); but it's always nice to hear when someone has at least enjoyed the content of whatever the heck I said (LOL)....
Thanks again, Glinka, I appreciate everyone's comments and replies.
- Ken
One thing that I love about Robert Heinlein’s novel “Stranger in a Strange Land” (which is about a human Martian coming to Earth, mind you) is how Michael (the protagonist and aforementioned) doesn't understand humor and laughter until he sees the irony inherent in a monkey being savagely beaten.
It's been awhile since I've read it, so I can't really elucidate further, but there is a sort of strange beauty innate in irony. Many proverbs and ancient philosophers speak of laughing at that which was once painful (so as to psychologically overcome it), and there's really a great truth in that. The disciplinarian at my school just asked me to get yet another haircut today, and I can't help but feel emasculated and ashamed every single time that it happens, but there will be the day that I am my own master and not shackled by the whims of conformists and tyrants. Thus, I look to forward to the day that I can heartily laugh at my beginnings and move onwards.
Interesting story and thread, Ken! :D
Thank you very much for your comments and reply, Venya, I was very moved reading about your above-mentioned ordeal at your school -- it reminds me of my own ordeal before I left my dad's house at age 18, because as long as I lived under his roof, my brothers and I were not allowed to have our hair any longer than military-length short haircuts. Please rest assured that your current situation of the negative anti-longhair atmosphere that you are having to endure right now is very very temporary.
Someday, I hope and pray to see the day when young men and males of any age are no longer mis-treated for simply wanting their hair to be a length of their own choosing. But, until that day comes, whenever it is not possible to fight a tyrannical school rule (and/or tyrannical parent, like I had to put up with myself when I was a kid), we can at least be comforted in knowing that we will soon be moving out of our current negative environment -- because progress out of oppression of any kind is the natural-born right of all people. PERIOD!
Included in my reply here is a pic of me & my brothers from the summer of 1965, when I was 12 years old. My dad had just married my step-mom, and I was thrilled to suddenly have gained 3 more brothers (my biological brother is to the far left of this pic; I'm the kid with the dorky smile on the far right)... Happy as I was in having my new step-brothers that year, my dad's mandatory tradition of crew-cuts on all 5 of us boys every summer was NOT something I ever wanted or agreed to.
But, the good news is: soon (even sooner than you think!) these unwanted haircuts (which, in my opinion, are really hair mutilations) will eventually become a thing of the past... and, YES, by then you'll even be able to laugh about it!
"Onward & Downward!" (in spite of the foolish tyrants who falsely think they are doing the right thing for you!)
- Ken in San Francisco
Yeah, Ken, I would've hated to be in your shoes quite simply for that reason! My closest male friend throughout high school had a dad like that, except that that guy wasn't as stringent at yours. My folks are apathetic about my hair, but as I said, it's my school that's the problem. I strongly disagree with the Church for that very reason: they make all of your decisions for you.
I find it rather ironic that in a nation colloquially referred to as “the Land of the Free and the Home of the Brave”, so many of us are self-aggrandizing ignoramuses who seek the ideal of power over freedom. There surely is a difference between a culture's ideal and the blatant reality, but I really hate how much I feel that I must fight to feel free in this country. Even after I graduate, there's always the threat of mandatory shearings in prison (which I doubt I'll ever come near, but still).
I'm being rather intense here, but hopefully you may understand, recognizing that this is still an active issue for me, and thus, a touchy nerve. But I agree whole-heartedly with you! May we see a day where men are free of this discrimination, and all people of many others!
Venya
P.S. - There was a question that I had for you, but I wasn't able to get it through MLHH’s indirect messaging system. Would you email me, so that I might ask it?
Great post Ken!
It's interesting to hear from someone who can relate to leaving a religion but still retaining part of its beliefs. I haven't gone regularly in about six years now and it's been a long and sometimes very confusing journey since then. It takes a long time to sort out what remains truth to me individually from the cult(like) aspects of the particular organization I left.
Its endless rules and obsession with statistics and outward appearances are easy to reject but along with that rejection comes some anger too. It has been tempting at times to throw out the proverbially baby with the bath water but I'm past that point now. I don't think any religion has a monopoly on truth right now but I feel reasonably happy with my core beliefs that I feel do make sense and provide some guidance in life.
Do you still use the Jehovah bible or the more mainstream King James Version?
To truly leave a cult and it's teachings would be to embrace either the Catholic or Protestant books in my opinion.
By the way I see Jehovah's Witness and Mormons as not being true Christians but very warped versions.
I hang out with Christian friends who feel that they don't need a church or organisation to have a relationship with Jesus Christ.
Though I don't consider myself a true believer, I don't mind what Jesus stood for at all and embrace his basic philosophy.
I feel similarly as your Christian friends. I don't think there is any Christian organization that holds "the truth". I don't believe any Protestant nor Catholic denominations are the way either. I personally believe that the full truth will be revealed when Jesus comes again. It will be at that point that everyone will have a decision to make on whom they want to serve and which government they support: Christ's or this world's.
The New World Translation has its good points and bad. It rightfully restores the name "Jehovah" in the Old Testament but it takes an unacceptable liberty of adding that name over 200 times to the New Testament when it was never there in the first place - at least as shown in the oldest manuscripts available. If that name is so essential, it would be found in the New Testament but it is simply not there.
I believe were part alien, call me crazy, no really call me crazy. James/ Tampa,Fl
That is a possibility James. We may have evolved with a little help from outside help. Perhaps we do indeed have a bit of alien DNA in us.
Our planet was made from star dust and the oceans from comets that slammmed into our world over billions of years.
Certainly I believe that in the past earth has received visitors from alien advanced civilisations who may very well have taught us stuff. Unfortunately one lesson we should have learnt was to live in peace with one another and not be so warlike and allow our leaders to tell us what to do.
Duncan
I completely agree with Duncan's comment.
I'm like your sister, more or less, Ken. By that I mean that my parents have always described themselves as agnostics, although I think my dad is more atheist, along with all his side of the family, and my mum is more of an agnostic for 'political' reasons, having had an anglican mother and an Irish catholic father.
I was christened as a methodist, merely because the methodist minister visited the hospital where I was born, and because my parents felt they had to have me christened but genuinely didn't care in what denomination. I suppose you could say I was raised as an agnostic, but even that is supposing a bit too much. I have never felt that I was restricted in religion in any way, although my dad makes fun of all religious belief. My mum used to watch 'Songs of Praise' on the BBC, allegedly just for the hymns, that being exactly what her parents used to do rather than choose between attending a catholic or an anglican church.
I am an atheist, and really feel that I always have been. Religious education is compulsory in English schools, and used to be anglican but switched to comparative religion whilst I was still in school. Never felt tempted by it except for maybe a few weeks when I was probably about five years old.
Hair doesn't really figure into the above anywhere atall. My battles over my hair were all with my mother, but certainly never included any religious element. I eventually understood that she doesn't like really long hair even on women, and I think it may be somewhat to do with her having grown up during WW2, when the latter was discouraged because they wanted women to work in munitions plants and so on, not that she ever did, being too young. Apparently the authorities were paranoid that women's long hair would be caught up in the machinery.
I'd say I'm pretty much agnostic, but with leanings towards theism. I'd like to think that there is a creator and someone who watches over us, but I just don't know. I'm not a believer in heaven and hell though, and I think most organised religions are more about controlling the flock than actually reaching out to God.
As for the Bible itself, and other religious texts too, not necessarily just Christian ones, I believe they have a lot to teach us about how to live our lives and that they provide a good moral compass. However, the same can also be said of old folk tales and fables.
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Read christopher hitchens book or look at his video on google "God is not great" James / Tampa,Fl
christopher Hitchens video ''God is not great''