new thread
Roger claims that cropping of the hair contributes to MPB and the reason women do not go bald is because they are allowed to grow their hair long.
now, where is the scientific data supporting these claims?
if this is factual and millions of Men in countries where short hair is the norm in the workplace obtain a copy of this book it could have some effect on the outcome of how Men decide to start wearing their hair.
what then will occur when employers continue to insist on closely cropped styles for Male employees if Millions of Men, who previously conformed to the company policy decided after reading Roger`s book that the way they wear their hair is going to change?
what does Roger or anyone else perceive might unfold if this is indeed proven scientifically by well respected scientists and Men are expected to continue with the closely cropped look or lose their jobs-their means of supporting themselves and their families?
Don't worry... this won't come to pass. For one thing, a lot of men actually LIKE having short hair. It's not like the majority of guys who get regular hair cuts are battling some inner demon every time they visit the barber. Also, although I have no doubt of his personal sincerity, Roger's "science" proceeds from a religious (biblical/christian) starting point. Historically, this means that a desired conclusion was created, and followed by data construed to support that conclusion, which is not a truly scientific method of searching for the truth. Note that this does not necessarily discount his theory that long hair promotes a healthy scalp; intuitively, this makes sense, and there may even be some as-of-yet inconclusive evidence supporting it, though that hardly constitutes rock solid, scientifically verifiable truth.
--Val
Hey Val,
As you know the book talks about religion, Scripture and so forth but includes much science from several non-religious sources. The book was meant to address the issue from many standpoints to counter hair prejudice. I am not the first to suggest that longer hair is healthier (check my 12/17/2011 post on this site). There I site Bernarr Macfadden. In the book I reference Dr. Loren Pickart of Skin Biology, Inc. and also Russian physician Dr. George Michael (now deceased I believe). As a scientist myself, I wholeheartedy agree with these others that longer hair is healthier.
Here's the situation: mainstream science or finding the "right scientist" to do some extensive study won't happen as you suggest because there is no money that can be made. Does mainstream science really want baldness to go away? Consider the billions of dollars that would be lost. The only thing they would do is invent some product to help (like Thymuskin) because repetitive sales brings cash. Natural prevention (what I teach) will help people preserve their hair.
As far as many men liking short hair - well this has largely been accomplished by peer pressure and force. Young men are forced to like it or else. Look how butchered the modern military is. When I speak on the topic I have convinced others to grow their hair out. Most don't grow it long, but at least they are growing it longer than before.
Anyway I hope this helps. Talk to you soon!
Roger claims that if Men grew their hair long they would not ever suffer from baldness and the reason women don't go bald is because they have long hair.
well, he obviously does not know his history well enough since between the years of 1910 and 1935+ the Bob revolution took hold and the majority of women cut their hair in very short bobs.
short hair for women returned sometime in the later 1940s and the Bob was resurrected by Vidal Sassoon in the 1960s and many of his styles also included the closely cropped Pixie Cut which was made famous by women such as Mia Farrow and Twiggy and has been worn in recent years by women such as Alyssa Milano, Natalie Portman and most recently Emma Watson.
none of these women have suffered any form of baldness.
as much as I am a HUGE advocate of Men growing their hair long I find some of his research questionable.
I am not saying that there is not any truth in his research, but the one regarding MPB has not been proven.
what really NEEDS to be done is some type of anti-discriminatory law against employers restricting hair length regardless of gender.
as I stated before, I believe if women are entitled to wear their hair long in the workplace the same should equally apply to Men, likewise if Men are entitled to wear closely cropped hairstyles the same should apply to women who desire a closely cropped style.
no one has a right to tell another person how long or how short their hair must be or cannot be! it should be an individual choice!
Discrimination MUST end!
I agree with you, Val, very well said! Here's an example of a life-long short-haired man VS a long-time longhaired man, a father and his son that I happen to know very well (LOL)....
My dad had short hair all of his adult life -- that famous 1950s "flat-top" look, from as far back as I can remember him, until the day he died at age 67. Although he had a bit of receding hairline at the temples, otherwise he had no MPB at all. The same with me: I have a bit of receding hairline at the temples; but otherwise no MPB whatsoever.
Similarly, I have friends in my C&W dance community that have shown me pics of themselves having long hair as a teenager and/or while in their early 20s, who now are completely bald on top. They cut their hair short after it thinned out while in their late 20s and/or early 30s to the point that they could no longer stand looking at themselves with that much hair loss -- a choice they made, but my point being that having long hair in and of itself does not necessarily mean it will "prevent" MPB. Genetics is still the main factor in determining this. To say otherwise is a bit misleading, in my opinion -- and yet I can understand and agree with the THEORY of Roger's statements in his book, but this does not fully play out in real life as a "fact", because all one has to do is look around and ask questions of anyone who has ever had MPB.
It would be nice if life and MPB were all that simple; but unfortunately there are other more powerful forces of Mother Nature that seem to play a bigger hand in determining genetic outcomes.
My $.02, anyway. Roger can argue all he wants with me about this; but all anyone has to do is look around a bit, maybe ask a few personal questions to a variety of bald men, and then eventually it won't take too long to come up with one's own conclusions. There's a big difference between a possible good theory and hardcore scientific "fact"... I like Roger's theories; but I'm definitely not sold on them as anything other than that.
- Ken
it is genetics!
and here is one good example.
It's funny you mention Ben Franklin. Roger actually uses him as an example for his theory. He says that IF Ben franklin had short hair, then he would most likely be bald all over, not just at the top. He had a predisposition to go bald, but the long hair helped him maintain some hair.
Hi Ken,
Long hair does not automatically mean a person will not go bald for there are many causes of hair loss. I cite just about all the manmade causes in my book. Observation is the first rule of science. If you contact Dr. Loren Pickart (a skin biologist, www.skinbiology.com), I'm sure he will talk with you. Ask him - he flat out told me short hair is the number one cause of baldness. I toned it down a little in my book and I also think there may be more than one cause (of hair loss) per individual. What I emphasize is that that there would be far less thinning hair and baldness if longer hair was worn. Will simply just having long hair stop someone from thinning if they have a predisposition to do so, not entirely. Some people can smoke their entire life and never get cancer, and yes some people can cut their hair short their whole life and not lose their hair. My book must be carefully read. I cite source after source - so go to the sources themselves.
I will try to summarize. First of all hair protects the head from overexposure to sun, micro-polutants and chemicals. You've seen sunburned heads full of rash, pimples and other infection - this is damage. These things can lead to cellular destruction and damage the follicle because these things can damage proteins, nerves, and even DNA. Brutal damage leads to skin cancer.
Understand that their are nerves, muscles, and the subcutaneous fat layer that sits on the scalp. The length of longer hair weighs much more than short hair leading to a stronger scalp that can withstand abuse better. Bernarr Macfadden's hair pulling technique helps exercize the scalp too. He recommends doing this everyday. I also cite Dr. Pickart's book about how longer hair reduces shedding. He agrees with Dr. George Michael who found that those with 4 inch hairs lost 87 hairs/day, but those with 12 inch long hairs only lost 26 hairs per day. Dr. Michael spent his entire life promoting long hair. His motto: "the longer the hair, the stronger the root."
I presented factual information in the book and I even footnoted everything so people could do their own research. As far as an exhaustive heavy duty scientific experiment, well I suppose we need to find someone willing to do it. The study of many people is needed over decades of study to prove it beyond shadow of doubt. I think there is enough evidence to show that short hair "accelerates baldness." But most people of the "system" are taught that hair is nothing but a dead waste product. So until mainstream science catches up, I guess I will stand my ground with those I have already cited on this and other posts. Like them, I'm just trying to promote long hair with that facts I was able to gather to this point. Peace.
How do you account for the number of women who have had closely cropped hairstyles who are not suffering from any loss of hair due to baldness?
also, when you stipulate 'cropped' are you talking about less than 4 inches or closely shaven scalps because there is a vast difference?
I eagerly await your response!
Paul,
Sorry for the belated response - busy with Christmas stuff. When women lose their hair or thin out it is usually all over their head more uniformly than men, who tend to recede. Females have less testosterone than men plus they have more fat in their bodies. They naturally have a thicker subcutaneous fat layer sitting on the scalp, which provides nutrition to the scalp. Their scalp can remain healthy better, if they grow long hair from youth. It has also been said that castrated men don't go bald. So in part (for some men), there is a hormonal imbalance issue. However, as Dr. Pickart has said: "many men have high testosterone metabolite levels but never suffer hair loss." He goes on to say that testosterone overload (DHT) is not the problem, but rather "an already damaged hair follicle susceptible to the negative effects of DHT." So how do men damage their follicles?
Men are not taught how to properly take care of their hair - most are taught to "just cut it off." Then we are taught to use store-bought shampoos, and to use them too much. Obviously hair 4 inches in length is better than being buzzed (or scalped). But 4 inches is the "minimum" I recommend, especially if you have sensitive skin or family history/predisposition of baldness. It would be better to grow longer hair than this, if you can. Short hair invites damage in many ways. Four-inch overlapping hairs on top (the crown) will protect the head from overexposure to the sun (be careful about parting the hair though - my sunburned scalp in the 1990s (when I wore shorter hair took about 10 years to completely heal - the scalp is indeed sensitive), but a buzzed head leads to scalp destruction just by this factor alone. Short hair, in general leads to a much thinner subcutaneous fat layer and weaker scalp muscles. Even the amount of oil extruded by the follicle is designed for longer hair. When cut short the oil has no place to go so it builds up on the scalp and within the follicles leading to loss. Then you are forced to use shampoos too much, which leads to more abuse, especially if you are using an alkaline shampoo or a product that contains "sodium lauryl sulfate" (also known as SLS - not recommended even for long hair, unless diluted). Now, hair length is not the only issue.
Whole body health is what is needed. To do all you can do, here's what I recommend: (1) chiropractic care to relieve stress in the spine/neck, which in turn will provide proper energy to your organs and the nerves up to the vertex of your scalp (where the hair whorl is); (2) eat lots of fruits and veggies; (3) supplements like "Ultra Hair" from Natures Plus; (4) get a chlorine showerhead filter (the "Sprite" brand can be purchased at Lowes, and probably Home Depot) - this is very important for total body health for chlorine in the water supply can lead to hair loss (in those with sensitive skin) and everyone now knows it causes cancer; (5) get a high quality shampoo like Super Hair Energizer (a fermented jojaba oil based product); (6) stay away from ALL "bulking up" products like steroids or creatine and such - unnecessary super-high, unnatural levels of testosterone are killers for the scalp; (7) spiritual peace - this is vital because the nerves that supply the follicles/papilla to the crown or top of the head are deeply rooted in the brain itself (i.e., they do not pass through the spinal cord); (8) tugging/pulling the hair slightly to stimulate the scalp is good - it's a form of massage; all muscles need massaged.
Paul, sorry for this lenghtly treatise - I hope it helps. But, if you have any more questions, I will be glad to help in any way I can.
Roger
I'd recommend buying the book. Roger did research this stuff and I'm assuming it wasn't free. Buy the book, read it, and bring whatever information seems missing or incorrect to the author's attention. I don't think it is fair to keep asking questions away w/o supporting a fellow longhair who worked hard to write a well researched book (believe me, it is well researched).
Just to add my 2 cents regarding the MPB topic, I haven't researched it as thoroughly as others, but i'd like to add my personal thoughts. How is it possible that over 50% of men today go through "genetic" baldness. Looking at history, we clearly see less baldness some 200-300 years ago (Roger shows and proves this in his book) yet today SO MANY men are bald or balding. In an age where pollution reigns free and people overuse products such as gel, SLS shampoos, and others, we can clearly see a correlation. It is ILLOGICAL to me that hair grows from birth and then just STOPS for men at 20-30. why then grow in the first place? People today blame EVERYTHING on genes and heredity. Things such as body fat, hair, and personality. To me this is all a load of bs. People need to take responsibility and stop pointing to genetics for everything. I am sure that there are people who have genetic predisposition to MPB, but not to the extreme that society makes us believe. Anyway get Mr. Sigler's book, it's very informative.
Neither sex should have anything less than Bob length(chin length)
what is the point of buzzing one's hair off to 1/2", 1/4" or less? this is asinine!
I do not think everyone should have mid-back hair if they do not want it, however there is no need to get a "Flattop" or any of those other disgusting military cuts. it only invites skin cancer.
I am not only disturbed at the number of Men still getting buzzcuts but the number of online sites others have shown me which promote head shaving of women. I find this very strange.
we were not meant to be bald and only those with really sick fetishes believe that is an ideal look imho and I do not care if it is for some alleged "charity". the truth is it is sold to freaks who get off on seeing women shaved bald.
sorry, if it offends ,but I think hair looks better than being bald even if it is not quite shoulder length!
Roger S:
Exactly right guys - we are not meant to be bald. This is why I spend so much time on the way head hair was originally designed. Personally, I don't think people are in their right minds buzzing or shaving their heads. For me, like many of you, I believe it is a terrible, sinister, disgusting thing to do. And many of even my friends (who went above the ears due to pressure) feel the same way. Why would anyone want to shave off a completely good full head of hair? This is why I relate (see pages 232-233 of my book) that most moderns suffer from trichotemnomania (hair cut madness)!
Loved your version of "Foolish Heart."
Many women don't know how to properly take care of long hair either. check out some makeover clips such as AMS #26 on youtube then compare to George Michael`s hair salon clips. there is a vast difference and they intentionally chose women with the worst manes for makeovers.
not all women's long manes look healthy. it's due to over-processing, bleaching and cheap hair dyes among not knowing the proper way of taking care of long hair.
of course it would. that's probably less than bob length.
so what causes dermatitis such as dandruff, seboria and such?
if you can. Short hair invites damage in many ways.
I think Bob(chin) length is acceptable on either sex, but this close cropped stuff especially clipper cuts is asinine and there is no real need for it! what is the purpose of having a 1/4" of hair on your head or less??
How short was your hair?
- the scalp is indeed sensitive), but a buzzed head leads to scalp destruction just by this factor alone.
of course and a shaved head is something that only invites skin cancer due to exposure to the sun. no one should really ware anything shorter than a Bob length.
I have seen that in gnc stores among other places
no problem, have a Happy New year!
I have been around for 56+ years, and my observations suggest that Roger is wrong. For a start, I wouldn't have suffered from MPB myself.
If only life were that simple.