new thread
Hi people!
Sorry that I've been away for so long but many [good] things have been going on lately.
Just wanted to check in to say Hi and to come out as a transgender woman to all of you. Many of you may have noticed some changes in the pictures that I've been uploading to Facebook.
I started this journey a few years ago growing my hair out, then I continued with laser hair removal.
Now, I am starting HRT ( hormones replacement therapy ) in a few days - which I am super excited for!
I am planning on getting my name legally changed in a few months too.
Just to give you a little background on how it is in my country , trans people can access HRT and other surgeries to adapt their bodies to their gender identity for free . Yes, for free. The government covers a 100% of the hormones treatment as well as any kind of surgeries to accomplish the image we look forward.
Also, we can legally change our sex and name without the intervention of a judge. You just go to the government office and get it changed in less than 30 minutes.
I have always lived as an androgynous guy - though some people even back then considered me a trans person -.
A few months ago I started to live full time as a woman except for the days I had to go to the office ( I would go as an androgynous guy).
This week I came out as trans at work . Most of my colleagues already knew this or suspected it. But now I made it official to my manager.
Hopefully , the place that I work at ( IBM ) has a very open minded corporate policy in favor of sexual diversity .
I will be working from home for a while before I go to the office as a woman. This is to allow HR staff to get all people ready and informed about what's going on and to give ME more time to prepare to show up in the office as a woman.
I have no problems in going out in public as a woman in front of people I don't know. But going to work is different so it needs time.
Oh, by the way , my new name will be Luciana Victoria.
Here I attach two photos ( for those of you who are curious to see how I look like ) with 0 months in hormones. I hope hormones will improve my image.
Hugs to everyone.
it's good to get this update and hear that things are going well.
I would mention that I know several trans individuals here in the US of A and i would mention the road they travel is a very difficult one. In the US of A there is much mis-understanding of
trans individuals, alot of discrimination.
I would also mention that in the US of A there are individuals wh0 are firmly opposed to homosexuals, and even more opposed to
trans people. it sounds like your country is more en=lightened than the US of A.
We've come a long way in USA - but we have a long way to go - you are so right...
In the US of A we have and we haven't. It all depends on where you are. For those in the gay community they've taken a number of steps forward but a number of states are pushing back hard.
On the other hand when it comes to the trans community they've made little to no progress.
Congratulations! Also, great that you are able to go through transition in a place that is supportive!
*********************
Wow, I have to admit this post was a bit of a surprise but not a shock since I did get to see some of your recent pictures on facebook.It's surreal as I never would have guessed this when we actually met last November in NYC.Regardless you have my support as this would never change my opinion of you.I enjoyed your company then and would in the future even after your transition.Thanks for the post and keep the faith my friend.Cheers and hugs .....
Mârk
Hello friend,
I am so happy to hear you are able to live in such an open-minded place! You have my support and I wish you nothing but the best! You are looking awesome in these pics I must say! I hope you continue to check in here and keep us updated on your life my friend! Please stay well and take care!
One Love, Ted
You have my support! I wish you the best and a happy full life free of anxiety. Do not be a stranger!
Darrin
Dave,
I have always appreciated your posts, your encouragement and your candid admissions of some of the struggles you've had. I wish you all the best as you transition and live as Luciana Victoria.
You are a beautiful human being, period.
My nephew was born as a girl and is now transitioned completely as a man. He is a successful psychiatrist now helping youth deal with the same issues he faced as a kid.
It's not easy. I am impressed with the freedom to make these moves in your country - and with the ability to have a health care system that supports it.
Fitz
Hi people! Sorry that I've been away for so long but many [good] things have been going on lately. Just wanted to check in to say Hi and to come out as a transgender woman to all of you. Many of you may have noticed some changes in the pictures that I've been uploading to Facebook ... I have always lived as an androgynous guy - though some people even back then considered me a trans person A few months ago I started to live full time as a woman except for the days I had to go to the office ( I would go as an androgynous guy). This week I came out as trans at work ... Oh, by the way, my new name will be Luciana Victoria ...
Dear Miss Luciana - Wow ! that is amazing - you've always been beautiful inside & out - so this will not change - I said recently in a video, about long hair, posted on 'youtube', that guys wanna look like guys, despite the feminizing nature of long hair, on males - this was a generalisation: ( of course ) - as you are a perfect example, where this does not apply - you are warm, intelligent, enthusiastic & courageous - you will do well, no matter your external appearance ... all human beings require & need respect & validation - & you have mine in spades - all the best on your new life journey ... warmest of regards to you CEM. ~~;0)
Hi Dave,
(I'll presume you are still going by that for now, since that is how you're posting. You'll have to let us know when you make the change, so we can use your new name and change the pronoun. You'll be doing that with lots of people I'd bet!)
On to replying to your post...
You have to be yourself! You only have one life to live, so you might as well live yours. I've heard it said that you can't live other people's lives anyway, because all those lives are already taken! [grin]
So I'll join in with others in saying, "Congratulations!" I'll also add that you're fortunate in that you're dealing with this issue early in your life. That will mean more years of being you!
Those of us who are born longhairs can empathize with you a lot. The issues are much the same. Where the two differ is how other people react to the two. We're all quite familiar with those differences and I won't belabor the point by laying them out here. I'll add that all "coming outs" have one thing in common. You will be getting rid of people who fell in love with someone who was not you and did not exist, and you will be replacing them with people who will be falling in love with you, someone who does exist.
It will be great to see you still around these parts, but if you need to get busy with finding new friends, of course we will all understand, and we'll miss you!
It's good to read that the response by your government will be supportive. Here in the U.S., that can vary a lot from one state to another. The trend, though, is to move in the direction of acceptance.
Changing one's name was always easy in the U.S., but some states have gotten picky about it since 9/11. The general rule has been that you can take any name that you want, but you can only have one legal name at a time, and you have to use it everywhere. Now, changing your sex, that has not been so easy. One major concern was what effect that would have on the marriage laws, but now that it looks like in a few months same-sex marriage will be legal throughout the U.S., that won't matter anymore.
Back in the early 1990s my workplace got a new employee and no one knew what sex he was. You just couldn't tell, and since no one had asked him, he never said. We had one unisex toilet, so choice of toilet gave no clue. He worked until 5 p.m. while most of us quit at 6 p.m. The minute he walked out the door, everyone quit work, looked at each other, and almost simultaneously said, "Boy or girl?" Just because I was gay, they "nominated" me to pop the question, because they needed to know what pronoun to use, and whether to call him "Mr." or "Ms." in correspondence with clients. It turned out he had been asked that question all his life and he answered it "male" without batting an eye when I asked him the next day. We later learned from him he was actually intersex, and he had chosen "male" because he was more comfortable with that than any other options.
My experience with him would suggest to me that one will have little trouble if they actually look like the sex they claim, but people really are driven to label others as one sex or the other, and remaining androgynous can be tough. Of course, you really do "have to be yourself", and that is what is most important!
And now that you've cut the ropes and are flying free, you may drift away in some respects from what you "have always" been. Many of us have done that when we grew our long hair. Don't fight it if it happens, truly finding yourself is a good thing!
In this town (San Francisco) I wonder what one would do to "live as a woman" beyond ducking into a different toilet and using a different pronoun, and what percent of the day does one do either of those things? Many of the women in this town dress like guys, have those dreadful short hair cuts that most guys go for, and have names that don't peg them as one sex or the other. You see a lot of beards in San Francisco on the men, and sometimes I wonder if this isn't a backlash from not wanting to look like all the girls around here!
People figure those things out. When I came out at work in 1979, about a third of my coworkers said they had already figured as much, a third were surprised, and a third truly weren't sure.
Here in the U.S. quite a few people when they transition move to a new town far away from the old one. Although you are being true to yourself, deep down you know there will be some feelings that you have been "lying", and by moving you can start a clean slate without those thoughts lingering over your head.
That's a beautiful name! It has eight times as many syllables as plain old "Dave", though, so get used to it taking much longer to introduce yourself!
Wishing you the very best,
Bill
WOW, i have to say I didn't see this coming; but in hindsight, I guess I'm not surprised!
Of course you have my full support -- you have to be the person you feel you are on the inside, by expressing it on the outside too. I've only known a sparse few transgender people, most of them being former female to male -- and even then, I didn't know them all that well. I did attend a wedding where the groom was trans (female to male), that being a couple of years ago.... the friends I went with knew him much better, and worried they might slip and use the wrong pronoun (LOL)! It was a great wedding though, one of the nicest I've ever been to!
Anyway, my best to you!!
- Ken
I have written quite a few reflections about androgyny on my blog in reaction to the conservative hyper-masculine mentality. I am very fond of the psychology of Jung and the ancient Gnostic tradition, its symbolism and messages for us today. The most creative people are those who are able to integrate their feminine characteristics of their personalities like gentleness, love of home, care for others, softness and so forth.
I have grappled with the gender issue, wanting to see behind the labels of androgynous and the various others words used these days that had a completely different meaning in the 1970's when I was a teenager, like queer. I accept being a male, but I have always shied away from competitive sports and the modern jungle of business and politics. My vocation as a priest tended more towards a contemplative kind of outlook rather than parish management - as it is now. I have always like intimacy in music and every aspect of life rather than grandeur and quantity.
Growing my hair was not for me a "feminine" thing in its initial motivation, but I identify with something other than the image the twentieth century projected of masculinity from our British public schools, Empire and Establishment elite to the various totalitarian movements in the 1920's to 1945.
Going through surgery and hormone treatment to reassign ourselves physically is a tad difficult for me to appreciate. My own "feminine" side is "psychological" and invisible. I have occasionally experimented with cross dressing at home, but it has never really been my "thing". Is it really possible to become the opposite sex rather than merely in appearance. Many of those who have gone through the surgery and hormone treatment have become very happy people.
Perhaps in your feminine life, you will experience masculinity in a different way, as is certainly already the case at present. I don't know you, but I have seen your photos and those of many other androgynous men. As I say, I needed to know myself better by comparison. I think androgyny comes in an infinite continuum of shades, and no one is completely masculine or feminine whatever the initial physical assignment (X and Y chromosomes) in most people other from those with Kleinfelter's Syndrome. I am certainly a little bit androgynous physically going by my full head of hair at my age, soft skin and very light beard. However, I would not want to be anything other than a biological male. But, that's me, not you.
You have a different life from me, and I can only wish you the greatest happiness in your inner identity. You are obviously ready to face the suffering you will have to go through as the operation wounds heal.
I have myself had a lot to learn about sexual diversity and respect for people even if I find it difficult to understand them. As one who has studied philosophy and theology, I am afraid of our who humanity becoming hidden by labels, stereotypes and caricatures. My thought is not guided by conservative ideology but criticism of the political systems of the last century and the very things that crush humanity.
Here is the link to my recent article: https://sarumuse.wordpress.com/2015/03/04/gender-bending/
I wrote it with prudence, since many of my readers are "conservatives", and there are some quite shocking comments. A very mixed-up kid wrote some quite violent comments, but I had to credit him with transparency and not ban him as a troll. I am more open to homosexual relationships than I will admit on my blog, but I baulk a little at the aggressive gay lobby than seeks to be intolerant to intolerance in the manner of the French Revolution. Oscar Wilde said that the most perfect imitation of Christ is being oneself, since Christ was perfectly himself - and suffered for it.
My whole thought has evolved over the years in a quest for true human freedom, the quest for happiness and love. It is not easy to find these qualities in the clash of ideologies. I don't pretend to have all the answers, but I do know we have to go beyond masks and appearances.
Finally, Dave / Luciana Victoria, I wish you every happiness and blessing in your new life. After all we all live with change and evolution, and hope that it is all for the greater good.
Anthony
My blog
My understanding of the way to look at it is someone who is trans
realized at an early age that they were born in the wrong body.
(Female trapped in a mans body, male trapped in a female body.)
Too many religious types insist that God doesn't make mistakes,
but in the instance for some reason trans people are trapped in the wrong body. I know some trans people and see what they go through, it's not a choice. It's becoming who they really are.
The gay lobby is not intolerant. Ultimately they want to be able to live their life day to day without some intolerant clowns deciding that because someone looks gay that they should
bash his or her head in with a baseball bat. When you compare the aggresive gay lobby you to compare it to the many cases of
gay folks being killed or badly hurt because they look gay.
The US of A has a really bad view of being gay. Too many people throw around the gay slur too easily especially in schools. And you can see how badly gays are viewed when you listen to the older generation. That is changing but it will take many years for gays, and even more years for trans folks.
No wonder the rate of suicide for LGBTQ folks is so high. There are those in the US of A who should be ashamed of the way they treat LGBTQ folks..
Thanks for the comments.
I do believe that there is a real question of gender identity in us all, from being hyper-masculine to being, as you say, a woman trapped in a man's body. Reading scientific articles has brought me to a philosophical outlook that makes reality follow perception and not the other way round as in Aristotelian metaphysics. In plain English, there are no standards or norms. There is only consciousness being formed by experience.
There was a psychiatrist who discussed the "delusions" of a schizophrenic. He wondered if the schizophrenic's perception was any less real than those who did not have that particular experience. I am not likening a gay or trans person to people we still consider to be mentally ill with all the stigmas. I am saying that I am increasingly open to a "multiverse" view of life in which what is real to one person is not real to another. I also come to the idea that all reality is illusion, and that consciousness is both fragmented and "organised".
I know that in America you have a lot of old conservatism, religious fundamentalism and intolerance that we used to have in Europe. I am glad for women's rights and the decriminalisation of homosexuality. We all have to become what we really are. The existence of MLHH is evidence of that in a society that expects men to cut their hair short. I am open to many things I don't personally relate to. At the base of that is a simple idea that we can expect to be tolerated if we tolerate others and welcome them with their differences.
A part of what fear is the totalitarian society in which we all have to be the same. It could be some Orwellian dystopia or something like what the Daesh thugs are bringing about in Irak and Syria. This should spur us to open our minds.
I suppose there are gay lobbies and gay lobbies. We live in a very polarised world, and many issues need to be resolved in a restricted or private context. But, that is a separate question from that of gender identity.
I hear many things about the USA and its tendency to oppose freedom and personality. Many things are being done against the Constitution and human rights like in my own country England. There could be a conservative backlash and many of us will be in trouble for being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
These are difficult questions. I am deeply disillusioned by conservatism and neo-conservatism. There are many approaches to solving the world's problems. Perhaps confrontation and provocation is one. Perhaps another is through culture and literature, and new approaches in churches and other religious communities.
Anthony
My blog
You're welcome.
Here in the US of A we have republicans who clamour for small government, government "small enough to drown in a bathtub."
But then they contradict themselves and want government to be large enough to be in every women's womb and dictate how they
handle pregnancy.
Indeed, the meaning of words does change. Sometimes you can confuse yourself if you don't back up from a distance and look at the situation. When you do, you'll in many cases realize that you have changed little, while the attitudes and words used by others have changed much more. If we measure ourselves by comparing ourselves to those shifting sands, we can be mislead into thinking we've changed more than we have. My own experience was that most elements of my identity were firmly nailed down by the time I was in my early twenties, but I didn't fully embrace them all in a major way until twenty years more had passed. And now, twenty years after that, I still see my explanation of them changing, merely because society has come to a better understanding of such situations and/or has coined better words to describe them.
And I measure my "maleness" most strongly in terms of having long hair, a full beard, and certain clothing. I see none of those things which are on MY yardstick as having even the most minute feminine component, and thus I don't see myself as having a "feminine side".
Wow, you looked much farther away than I did to formulate your identity. I grew up in a mining town and went to college among a bunch of hippies. There were people in those places who I actually SAW. In my town there were the coal miners and farmers on one hand and businessmen on the other. In college there were the freaks and the straights. I identified with the miners and the freaks. And an example of how terminology changes is that what we called "freaks" were soon thereafter called "hippies" and that word stuck. And heterosexuals coopted the word "straights" while "yuppies" supplanted it. So I now say my "gender identity" is "Male longhaired hippie". Along the way, and we see it on here, we were saying we were "born longhairs". More people understand "gender identity" now, so I use that when not among other longhairs. But I have not changed! Just the words to describe me have. One could say that to me there are two genders of "men" (hippies and yuppies), and I am definitely one of them and not the other. I see hippies as far more "male" than yuppies. My long hair doesn't therefore make me "feminine". It makes me more male!
I've tried that with yuppie clothing, but it just didn't stick. I'd rip it off that very night, if not before. As for female clothing, the female gender is so far from my identity that I'd never see any reason to try it.
With each "coming out" (hair, beard, clothing, sexual orientation) I've become happier each time. Being yourself is GOOD!
And explaining it gets easier, just because the world is getting more educated. I used to have a page on my web site describing how I could have the gender identity I have. When Facebook recently admitted there are more gender identities than just two, tried listing fifty, and then just gave people a blank to fill in, I realized this stuff was now all in the public consciousness. My web page no longer served a purpose and I removed it. Society had advanced to where it was no longer needed!
Bill
Hi Bill and Anthony,
Just wanted to say how much I enjoyed reading both of your comments. Not sure I have much to contribute myself on this topic, as I'm a little brain-dead tonight (LOL); but I loved reading your thoughts on masculinity / femininity, identity, etc.
One of the nicest compliments I remember ever receiving was back when I was in my 20s, when I was a student Christian Science Nurse in training. My on-the-job Instructor and Supervisor once told me that I had a "nice balance of male and female qualities" as a nurse (although no longer my profession). To me at the time, I took it to mean that my personality and qualities of character were neither too rough and aggressive, nor were they too soft & weak; but that I had somehow struck a balance of both strength and gentleness, kindness yet firm and clear, etc.... I've always viewed it as perfectly OK for a man to have a sweetness about him, and that this was not necessarily "feminine" for him to be that way; so as far as personality and character traits go, regardless of whether we are male or female, we should all strive for a balance.
But now, back to the topic of HAIR:
I agree with you Bill, long hair on a man does not at all make a man look feminine -- EXCEPT whenever make up or clothing intentionally alters the appearance to look like a woman... That's when I don't always have such an easy time dealing with confusion about it. To me, as a longhaired man, I want to look as masculine as I possibly can -- I don't care to have anybody feel "confused" when they look at me! I'm just a guy with long hair. There's nothing physically "feminine" about me (that I know of - LOL)!
- Ken
I concur Kenny 1000% , with your post - such a fascinating thread, that all here, seem to be relating to - Bill's & Tony's posts & blogs were riveting ... I ( like you ) love being a man, being masculine & all that comes with it - however I'm not hyper-masculine & my long blonde hair has always been associated with extreme femininity - so there's the rub !!! ... loving & wanting to be masculine but having hair instantly associated with feminine stereotypes ... androgyny manifests on a continuum: ( like many things in life ) ... ultimately being ourselves & moving out into the world with pride & confidence is really our only option for true contentment & happiness both inside & out - Miss Luciana is a great example where the androgyny manifests in gender reassignment - whereas, most of the rest of us, fall at the opposite end of the scale - but on the scale we sit: ( this applies to outer appearance & personality traits too: ( as you so rightly mentioned - a soft, caring, nurturing nature for example etc. ) ... thank you to Luciana & all the wise men here for such a wonderful discussion piece ... CEM.
Thanks to everyone for your kind words and support! It really means a lot to me.
I have an update!
Today I spoke to my manager who had spoken to Human Resources yesterday. She told me that I became the first transgender employee in IBM worldwide history so all eyes are going to be on me and on my area next Monday when I hit the company.
Kinda scary.
Hi friend,
I am very happy to hear this good news! I have full faith and confidence you will go forth and make a big positive impact at your company! Scary yes. But you can do it!
Much love, Ted
From what I understand that is not true. Apparently there was a
transgender individual who worked for IBM in 1968, was subsequently fired for being transgender.
Wow, I did not know about her story.
Nowadays, IBM has a very strong corporate policy regarding sexual diversity at work. This policy is so strong that IBM is willing to fire anyone who discriminates an GLBT person.
I have no idea how old this policy is but it is probably something related to Lynn's case for sure.
Yesterday I was told by several managers that I was the first case of a trans person working at IBM. Probably IBM is not even considering Lynn's case because they are hiding it as something shameful?
I am not sure whether you want to be addressed as Dave or Luciana at this point, sorry about that. In any case, I hope that you do not get harassed or threatened during the transition. I do not know how to relate feelings on this sort of an issue after having gone through my own gender confusion issues because my dad raped me when I was 14 years old, and at least once thereafter as well. My emotions on this sort of a topic are too complex for me to express adequately.
I think I wondered about how you viewed your sexual orientation from your moniker picture from the start. For me it was not your hair, rather the look in your eyes and face.
If you are discriminated against at work or fired you, you could probably (if only eventually) find jurisdiction in New York State in the United States because the corporate headquarters is located in Armonk, New York, USA. New York courts are pretty progressive, so I think it should be pretty easy for you to have a case. The only question would be court of original jurisdiction, but if Argentina is as liberal as you are saying, then there should probably be legal protections in place so that you are not discriminated against.
I hope that you get treated better at work than I did when I was having my issues last Summer. A major life change like this usually brings out the true character of the people around you and quickly. In order to be successful in court in the United States you need to document any discrimination regarding treatment, promotions, placement, and anything else that is important to retaining your job. It is important to keep a journal, either on paper or on a computer. Record as soon as possible who said what as a direct quote. Record what was done as soon as possible, also, document any omissions that are unique to you in the same way. Make certain to include the date and time that the incidents occur in the documentation you make.
I hope all of this process is safe and healthy for you.
A person needs to be true to themself. Good for you and
good luck with your future.